Timeless Wisdom from Holy Scripture: Holy Bible, Holy Qur'an & ...

[sear]

"The funny thing is that when Mohammed married Khadija, a wealthy widow, he wanted to please her, so increased the rights of women." R5 #20

"increased the rights of women" but still subordinate to men.

"Islam is based on Judaism, but just with the addition of the right of women to be able to own property, inherit, testify, divorce, etc.
So it is odd how Moslems are criticized for being unequal to women." R5 #20

Malala Yousafzai won a Nobel Prize for surviving a gunshot wound to the head.
For what unpardonable sin did the Taliban shoot her? For attending school. If the reports are true, representative, the criticism is well deserved.

"When you read about women being stoned to death or burned at the stake, that is not Islam, because Islam allows only for quick and painless beheading." R5 #20

a) For what offense or violation are they executed? Did they have representation at trial? Were they provided an opportunity to appeal their conviction?

b) I didn't see the vid, but heard some audio of journalist Daniel Pearl being beheaded by his Pakistani captors. It was neither quick, nor painless.

 

[Rigby5]

"increased the rights of women" but still subordinate to men.


Malala Yousafzai won a Nobel Prize for surviving a gunshot wound to the head.
For what unpardonable sin did the Taliban shoot her? For attending school. If the reports are true, representative, the criticism is well deserved.


a) For what offense or violation are they executed? Did they have representation at trial? Were they provided an opportunity to appeal their conviction?

b) I didn't see the vid, but heard some audio of journalist Daniel Pearl being beheaded by his Pakistani captors. It was neither quick, nor painless.

Mohammed went as far as he dared to make women equal.
The problem is the Mongol invasion of 1200 wiped out the Moslem leadership in Baghdad, and the people reverted back to tribal Judaism really.
So current Moslems do not reflect actual Islam necessarily.

But it was just one person who shot Malala, so we do not really know the reason.
Since there are lots of Afghan women in colleges, I would suspect the problem was over the western university Malala was attending.

 

[sear]

"women" R5 #22

I encounter written or televised reports of women there being required to be subservient to men.
- Women not allowed in public without a male escort.
- In Saudi Arabia women not allowed to drive a car alone.
- Even when a sleeveless sack called a "burka" isn't required, the hijab or head-scarf may be.

 

[Rigby5]

I encounter written or televised reports of women there being required to be subservient to men.
- Women not allowed in public without a male escort.
- In Saudi Arabia women not allowed to drive a car alone.
- Even when a sleeveless sack called a "burka" isn't required, the hijab or head-scarf may be.

Those are not rules of "subservience" but of protection.
There is no history of local police force, so no really good way to prevent rape.

If one looks at the Old Testament, the burka and hijab are required by all Jews as well, and even the men are supposed to wear a turban to cover their hair.
The kippah or yarmulka is minimal base under a turban.

 

[Shiftless2]

If one looks at the Old Testament, the burka and hijab are required by all Jews as well, and even the men are supposed to wear a turban to cover their hair.

Got a reference for both of those?

 

[Rigby5]

Got a reference for both of those?

This is not a great link, but gets the idea.

https://biblehub.com/q/bible's_view_on_head_coverings.htm

 

[sear]

"Those are not rules of "subservience" but of protection." R5 #24

It might be considered "protection" if compliance were voluntary, thus non-compliance equally acceptable. Nothing recent enough for me to offer a link, but I seem to recall news reports police beating persons found out of compliance.

"If one looks at the Old Testament, the burka and hijab are required by all Jews as well" R5 #24

That's fine. But your comment addresses holy scripture that's millennia old.
The issue here isn't what the standard was back then, but what Islamic / Islamist cultures in the third millennium Middle East apply today, and how deviations from such standards are punished.

 

[Rigby5]

It might be considered "protection" if compliance were voluntary, thus non-compliance equally acceptable. Nothing recent enough for me to offer a link, but I seem to recall news reports police beating persons found out of compliance.


That's fine. But your comment addresses holy scripture that's millennia old.
The issue here isn't what the standard was back then, but what Islamic / Islamist cultures in the third millennium Middle East apply today, and how deviations from such standards are punished.

No, you missed the point.
Which is simply that Moslems try to remain faithful, while Jews have ignored the Old Testament and stopped following their own laws.

 

[sear]

No, you missed the point.
Which is simply that Moslems try to remain faithful, while Jews have ignored the Old Testament and stopped following their own laws.

Well then I have an eye-opening counterpoint.

"Dear Dr. Laura,
Thank you so much for trying to educate people regarding god's law. I have learned a great deal from you, and I try to share that knowledge with as many people as I can.
When someone tries to defend the homosexual lifestyle for example, I simply remind him that Leviticus 18:12 clearly states it to be an abomination. End of debate.
But I need some advice from you, regarding some of the other specific laws and how best to follow them.
When I burn a bull on the altar as a sacrifice, I know it creates a pleasing odor for the lord (Leviticus 1:9), the problem is my neighbors. They claim the odor is not pleasing to them. How should I deal with this?
I would like to sell my daughter into slavery as suggested by Exodus 21:7. What do you think a fair price would be? I know I am allowed no contact with a woman while she is in her period of menstrual uncleanliness (Leviticus 19:24).
The problem is, how do I tell? I have tried asking. But some women take offense. I have a neighbor who insists on working on the Sabbath. Exodus 35:2 clearly states he should be put to death. Am I obliged morally to kill him myself, or may I hire a hit-man?
I know you have studied these things extensively, and so I am confident you can help.
Thank you again for reminding us that god's word is eternal, & unchanging."

So much for "remaining faithful", after a few thousand years, and a staggering amount of wisdom accumulated to displace or enhance the mythopoeic mumbo-jumbo.

"thou shalt not sow thy field with mingled seed: neither shall a garment mingled of linen and woolen come upon thee" Leviticus 19:19

The purist has the ideological benefit of purity. But I can't think of any pure human behavior system that isn't improved by modification, impurity if you like.

I often wear a T-shirt. And while I enjoy 100% Cotton towels in the bath, for shirts I prefer 65% poly 35% Cotton. I imagine I'll roast in Hell for an eternity or two. BUT ! At least I'll die comfortable.

 

[Shiftless2]

For the record, there are three sets of “ten commandments” in the Bible. But the bible only refers to one of them as the “Ten Commandments”. And guess what. It’s not the set you see carved on monuments or that I was forced to memorize in grade school. It’s very different

The Ten Commandments

1. For thou shalt worship no other god: for the LORD, whose name is Jealous, is a jealous God:

2. Thou shalt make thee no molten gods.

3. The feast of unleavened bread shalt thou keep.

4. All that openeth the matrix is mine; and every firstling among thy cattle, whether ox or sheep, that is male.

5. Six days thou shalt work, but on the seventh day thou shalt rest: in earing time and in harvest thou shalt rest.

6. And thou shalt observe the feast of weeks, of the firstfruits of wheat harvest, and the feast of ingathering at the year's end.

7. Thrice in the year shall all your menchildren appear before the LORD God, the God of Israel.

8. Thou shalt not offer the blood of my sacrifice with leaven; neither shall the feast of the Passover be left until the morning.

9. The first of the firstfruits of thy land thou shalt bring unto the house of the LORD thy God.

10. Thou shalt not seethe a kid in his mother's milk.

After giving these commandments, God said...

Exodus 34

27 And the LORD said unto Moses, Write thou these words: for after the tenor of these words I have made a covenant with thee and with Israel.
28 And he was there with the LORD forty days and forty nights; he did neither eat bread, nor drink water. And he wrote upon the tables the words of the covenant, the ten commandments.

This is the only place in the Bible in which you will see commandments from God being call "The Ten Commandments".

The Ten Commandments

This is about the time that someone is going to say “but all those Old Testament laws are no longer valid”. However that’s not true. Jesus made it clear that all of the laws of the Old Testament would stand until the end of time. That’s all of them. Not just the ones they like.

He spoke specifically on the topic of Old Testament teachings:

The Law Stands

“For truly, I say to you, till heaven and earth pass away, not an iota, not a dot, will pass the law until all is accomplished. Whoever then relaxes one of the least of these commandments and teaches men so, shall be called least in the kingdom of heaven; but he who does them and teaches them shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.” — Matthew 5:18-19

“It is easier for Heaven and Earth to pass away than for the smallest part of the letter of the law to become invalid.” (Luke 16:17)

“Do not think that I have come to abolish the law or the prophets. I have come not to abolish but to fulfill. Amen, I say to you, until heaven and earth pass away, not the smallest part or the smallest part of a letter will pass from the law, until all things have taken place.” (Matthew 5:17)

“Did not Moses give you the law, and yet none of you keepeth the law” (John7:19)

But if you want to know how the people that wrote the Old Testament decided there should only be ten of them

Or we could look to history - Moses never existed, the Israelites were never slaves in Egypt, and the Exodus never happened. But lets not let fact get in the way of a good story.

 

[sear]

"For the record, there are three sets of “ten commandments” in the Bible. But the bible only refers to one of them as the “Ten Commandments”." S2 #30

Thank you S2.
I checked KJV online: https://www.kingjamesbibleonline.org/search.php?hs=1&q=ten+commandments
Years ago I attempted to obtain the exact KJV wording of the 10 Commandments, and failed. So my alternate source for this metaphysical truth? Hallmark?

"Or we could look to history - Moses never existed, the Israelites were never slaves in Egypt, and the Exodus never happened. But lets not let fact get in the way of a good story." S2 #30

Christian zealots, scriptural absolutists have even if inadvertently undermined the Holy Bible as credible historic account.
But, not sure it makes sense to disregard all Biblical wisdom, because we found a flaw.

"there is nothing covered, that shall not be revealed; neither hid, that shall not be known." St. Luke 12:2

"in time, all will be reviled." Wolf 2uk

 

[Rigby5]

I do not care for Islam because it is too strict, but at least they are not hypocrites like the Zionists, and they at least try to remain faithful.
I do think the Old Testament is so bad that it needs to be repudiated.
The whole idea of a "Chosen People" is the exact opposite of a democratic republic.

And the colonial imperialism of the Byzantine Romans is no better.
We should be able to a lot better now.