For my Canadian friends

[sear]

"We do not really know how much heat the extra CO2 is going to retain" R5 #460

I got the impression climatologists had calculated it fairly precisely.

"... so it could go the way of Venus and reach deadly temperatures like over 300 degrees." R5 #460

If we don't kill ourselves off first.

"But it also may take a long time, so in our lifetime, a migration to the poles may help?" R5 #460

You can't K-turn a battleship in a bathtub.
Some reports I've read of it indicate if we dropped the increase in atmospheric CO2 to zero%, there's still a 100 year lag time before the planet would restabilize at its new set-point.

"The oddest part is that the easiest fix would just be more tree planting, but it does not look like that is going to happen." R5 #460

I doubt we'll dig up any parking lots for that.

 

[Rigby5]

I got the impression climatologists had calculated it fairly precisely.


If we don't kill ourselves off first.


You can't K-turn a battleship in a bathtub.
Some reports I've read of it indicate if we dropped the increase in atmospheric CO2 to zero%, there's still a 100 year lag time before the planet would restabilize at its new set-point.


I doubt we'll dig up any parking lots for that.

Its not quite that settled science.
We are really talking about CO2 being opaque to the low frequency infrared heat that would normally leave the planet by radiating out into space.
Since this only happens on the edge of space, we can't easily run experiments on it.
And even more complex is that about 10% of the climate scientists have faith that as the planet warms, there will be more water vapor in the atmosphere, that will lead to a more constant cloud cover, that will reflect more sunlight before it can even start to warm the planet.
This is complex because the melting polar and glacial ice has instead decreased planetary albedo, so it is hard to calculate what the increase will actually do?
However, I do not look forward to constant cloud cover.
I kind of like seeing stars in the sky.

 

[Shiftless2]

Let’s summarize this again for those who dont understand or believe everything Conservatives keep repeating.

Refining more oil in Canada would NOT lower gas prices.

Gas prices in Canada are primarily driven by global market rates, not by how much refining capacity we build domestically.

Crude oil is a commodity. Like wheat or gold, its price is set on global markets. Canadian oil prices and gasoline prices are tied to international benchmarks such as WTI and Brent. That means global supply and demand determines the price long before it reaches a pump in Canada.

We’ve already seen how this works.

When Russia invaded Ukraine in 2022, gas prices across Canada spiked past two dollars per litre within weeks. That wasn’t because Canada suddenly ran out of refineries. It was because the global oil market reacted.

Canada already has a significant refining industry. In fact, Canada refines more oil than it consumes in some regions. At the same time, the country still exports crude and imports certain refined fuels. That’s largely due to transportation logistics and regional infrastructure, not a lack of refining capacity.

And then there’s the comparison people love to make with Norway.

Norway’s oil wealth comes from a heavily state owned and state controlled system managed by the Norwegian government.

In Canada, Conservatives usually call that communism.

SOURCE with comments

 

[Rigby5]

View attachment 4595

Let’s summarize this again for those who dont understand or believe everything Conservatives keep repeating.

Refining more oil in Canada would NOT lower gas prices.

Gas prices in Canada are primarily driven by global market rates, not by how much refining capacity we build domestically.

Crude oil is a commodity. Like wheat or gold, its price is set on global markets. Canadian oil prices and gasoline prices are tied to international benchmarks such as WTI and Brent. That means global supply and demand determines the price long before it reaches a pump in Canada.

We’ve already seen how this works.

When Russia invaded Ukraine in 2022, gas prices across Canada spiked past two dollars per litre within weeks. That wasn’t because Canada suddenly ran out of refineries. It was because the global oil market reacted.

Canada already has a significant refining industry. In fact, Canada refines more oil than it consumes in some regions. At the same time, the country still exports crude and imports certain refined fuels. That’s largely due to transportation logistics and regional infrastructure, not a lack of refining capacity.

And then there’s the comparison people love to make with Norway.

Norway’s oil wealth comes from a heavily state owned and state controlled system managed by the Norwegian government.

In Canada, Conservatives usually call that communism.

SOURCE with comments

That is why I see communism as vastly superior.
There is no reason to let some monopoly double the price of goods compared to what they cost to make.

 

[sear]

"That is why I see communism as vastly superior.
There is no reason to let some monopoly double the price of goods compared to what they cost to make." R5 #464

- fine -
BUT !
Perpetrating fossil fuel commerce at production cost, instead of environmental impact cost is a shortcut to the flaming torments of Hell.

The chlorophyll impregnated leaves that converted the sunlight into the raw material that additional geological forces converted into petroleum over millions of years,
that's all a long-term natural process.

We're consuming that naturally accumulated energy in a minuscule fraction of the time it took to collect and concentrate it.
The cost of production simply doesn't reflect realistically on either its true cost, or its true value.

 

[Rigby5]

- fine -
BUT !
Perpetrating fossil fuel commerce at production cost, instead of environmental impact cost is a shortcut to the flaming torments of Hell.

The chlorophyll impregnated leaves that converted the sunlight into the raw material that additional geological forces converted into petroleum over millions of years,
that's all a long-term natural process.

We're consuming that naturally accumulated energy in a minuscule fraction of the time it took to collect and concentrate it.
The cost of production simply doesn't reflect realistically on either its true cost, or its true value.

Oil conservation is especially important once one realizes that the oil we are burning is also the essential means of providing nitrogen, phosphorus, potassium, etc., for food fertilizers.
When we run out of oil, we can switch to things like solar, wind, or nuclear power, but nothing can replace the fertilizers we need.