What to call this thread?
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Shiftless2
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The Council of State of Greece dismissed constitutional challenges, upholding the law allowing same-sex civil marriage and adoption rights under Greek law
Shiftless2
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Believe it or not the Mormon church just found out a way to be even worse .....
www.facebook.com
The LDS Church just updated its official handbook to make clear that transgender members are second-class believers. From Temple access to participation in sacred rituals, the message is clear: conform or be excluded. Here’s what changed and why
The LDS Church just updated its official handbook to make clear that transgender members are second-class believers. From Temple access to participation in sacred rituals, the message is clear:...
www.facebook.com
Shiftless2
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Shiftless2
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Thanks to the 3 of you.
Shiftless2
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Just some of the women who would fail the IOC sex tests now.
None of them are Trans.
The IOC insists that their test is based on science, they just won't tell you who the "scientists" were who told them that. They've kept them anonymous.
"Frankfurter Allgemeine put to her the official argument of World Athletics, which claims that the SRY is "a reliable indicator for determining biological sex". Karkazis was unequivocal: there is no scientific evidence linking it to an advantage in sporting performance. "No one has yet been able to find any connection between this gene and athletic performance," she reminded, emphasising that even the discoverer of the gene admits it cannot be used as a tool to determine biological sex."
It does remove obvious difficulties now in holding the Olympics in the USA, as it is in accordance with Trump’s executive order saying that these women don't exist.
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For those wondering why the discoverer of the gene makes the note:
The SRY gene cannot be used as the sole determinant of biological sex because its presence (on the Y chromosome) does not guarantee typical male development, nor does its absence guarantee female development. Due to genetic translocations, mutations, or hormone resistance (like Androgen Insensitivity Syndrome), individuals can have an SRY gene but develop as females (XY females), or lack it but develop as males (XX males).
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Shiftless2
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Idaho lawmakers on Friday approved what might be the nation’s most restrictive transgender bathroom bill, criminalizing the use of bathrooms, locker rooms or changing rooms, even in private businesses, by people whose sex at birth does not match the facilities’ sign. https://nyti.ms/4uX0SZ0
Shiftless2
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POINT: #1,468 & #1,469
Marginally enlightening at best.
COUNTERPOINT: #1,471
Problem is, this criticizes what we may believe to be sincere government effort to maintain fairness.
Criticism is easy.
Got a better idea?
#1,470
The difference between a group of baby foxes, and a women's track team:
One is a pack of cunning runts, and the other is a ... oops, someone's at the door.
Marginally enlightening at best.
COUNTERPOINT: #1,471
Problem is, this criticizes what we may believe to be sincere government effort to maintain fairness.
Criticism is easy.
Got a better idea?
#1,470
The difference between a group of baby foxes, and a women's track team:
One is a pack of cunning runts, and the other is a ... oops, someone's at the door.
Shiftless2
Well-known member
No idea how either of these is "enlightening" (unless you're referring to the fact that it points out the bigotry of the decision makers).
1,468 simply points out that the so called "science" the IOC is supposedly basing its decision on is wrong (the fact that they won't name the scientists demonstrates that they know that).
And the authors of #1,469 obviously want this guy in the ladies' room
And the think that this little girl would be safe in the men's room
Still no offer of a substitute / superior proposal. Just more fault-finding with those that are attempting to address the issue for others.
Shiftless2
Well-known member
"A broken clock is right twice a day." analog aphorism
The point seemingly legitimately made in #1,474 (I'm not validating it, but I'm not aware of any conspicuous error) is the imperfection of responding to this issue, now persisting for most of a century.
I take no shame in being a utilitarian pragmatist.
CERTAINLY the rights of each individual must be considered. BUT !!
It is anti-democratic for a small minority to overrule the vast majority.
That does NOT legitimize cramming the corpses of non-binaries through the wood-chipper.
OTO finding a reasonable compromise fair to all is easier said than done on this issue.
And #1,474 is merely more self-righteous whining, not a constructive alternative proposal.
Shiftless2
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Excellent question.
To invoke Paul Harvey, your question shucks right down to the cob.
The reason is Phelps' exceptionality is reportedly natural,
whereas those whose differentiation is artificial raises questions.
Regarding them, there are arguments on both sides.
Until those arguments are resolved to scientific consensus, the red flag waves.
But for now, according to disclosures in your own posts, we haven't even settled the matter of the criteria for making the distinction.
Shiftless2
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So is Caster Semenya's but that doesn't stop them from penalizing her.
The presence or absence of the SRY gene is completely natural.
And, as the discoverer of the gene points out, it's not a reliable indicator of they're trying to accomplish.
Fact is, any and all world class and Olympic athletes are exceptional. No matter how hard the average Joe/Jill trains they're not going to win an Olympic medal. They're not even going to make the team.
Seems to me we need:
- reliable, accurate standards, &
- equitable enforcement
Thus not a viable standard on its own, even if integrated into a broader spectrum of qualifications & distinctions.
As I imagined.
Thus, at the first Olympic competition,
what matters is not whether or not the competitors are extraordinary,
but whether they are extraordinary naturally.
It appears to be a distinction more easily made in cyber-discussion than in Olympic implementation. BUT !
For the benefit of the majority of competitors whose genders remain as identified at birth, we slog ahead, and with luck, skill, and insight, forward.